Comments on: Ignatius Proposes a 'New Deal for the CIA' That's Two Centuries Old http://www.fair.org/blog/2009/09/17/ignatius-proposes-a-new-deal-for-the-cia-thats-two-centuries-old/ The national media watch group Fri, 10 Feb 2012 11:27:06 -0600 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.2 hourly 1 By: September 2009 « Questionable Content http://www.fair.org/blog/2009/09/17/ignatius-proposes-a-new-deal-for-the-cia-thats-two-centuries-old/comment-page-1/#comment-39477 September 2009 « Questionable Content Mon, 06 Sep 2010 15:58:58 +0000 http://www.fair.org/blog/?p=12954#comment-39477 [...] http://www.fair.org/blog/2009/09/17/ignatius-proposes-a-new-deal-for-the-cia-thats-two-centuries-old... [...] [...] http://www.fair.org/blog/2009/09/17/ignatius-proposes-a-new-deal-for-the-cia-thats-two-centuries-old... [...]

]]> By: Nightgaunt http://www.fair.org/blog/2009/09/17/ignatius-proposes-a-new-deal-for-the-cia-thats-two-centuries-old/comment-page-1/#comment-9418 Nightgaunt Mon, 28 Sep 2009 05:21:44 +0000 http://www.fair.org/blog/?p=12954#comment-9418 Over a long span of time it has been shown that torture isn't used in fact finding, it is use in obtaining expected confessions. Certainly the Catholic Inquisition found it useful in getting those they had to say whatever it is they wanted to stop the pain. Most weren't allowed to escape alive, but the pain did stop. So if our gov't is uninterested in actual facts then this is the way to go. Many an empire and despotic political organization swears by it. Our little slice of terror at home, as American as scalping (both sides did it) and hanging of witches and black men also kangaroo courts for the death penalty. The darker side of the country that seems to want full reign here and now. All that's missing is the suspension of the Bill of Rights in toto. Which could still come at any time. Everything is still in place to do it. Over a long span of time it has been shown that torture isn't used in fact finding, it is use in obtaining expected confessions. Certainly the Catholic Inquisition found it useful in getting those they had to say whatever it is they wanted to stop the pain. Most weren't allowed to escape alive, but the pain did stop. So if our gov't is uninterested in actual facts then this is the way to go. Many an empire and despotic political organization swears by it. Our little slice of terror at home, as American as scalping (both sides did it) and hanging of witches and black men also kangaroo courts for the death penalty. The darker side of the country that seems to want full reign here and now. All that's missing is the suspension of the Bill of Rights in toto. Which could still come at any time. Everything is still in place to do it.

]]> By: Doug Latimer http://www.fair.org/blog/2009/09/17/ignatius-proposes-a-new-deal-for-the-cia-thats-two-centuries-old/comment-page-1/#comment-9254 Doug Latimer Thu, 17 Sep 2009 19:24:11 +0000 http://www.fair.org/blog/?p=12954#comment-9254 There's this presumption - giving Ignatius the benefit of the doubt that he actually believes his own bullshit - that immoral and illegal intel actions somehow protect the country better than moral and legal ones. Not that that would be a argument for doing so if it were true, but where has that been proven? His own example of de Clarens shows that no matter how vicious a nation's intelligence "community" is, determined adversaries can accomplish their missions, doesn't it? And that very viciousness is what motivates many to undertake those missions, isn't it? A US that didn't seek to dominate the world wouldn't have some of the victims of that imperial impulse willing to do the bidding of bin Laden and others, would it? I know I'm pissing in the wind here. This country has acted with immoral impunity since day one. No big surprise - it's what most gummints do the world over - but the US has made an art form of the hyprocrisy of it, don't you think? There's this presumption – giving Ignatius the benefit of the doubt that he actually believes his own bullshit – that immoral and illegal intel actions somehow protect the country better than moral and legal ones.

Not that that would be a argument for doing so if it were true, but where has that been proven? His own example of de Clarens shows that no matter how vicious a nation's intelligence "community" is, determined adversaries can accomplish their missions, doesn't it?

And that very viciousness is what motivates many to undertake those missions, isn't it? A US that didn't seek to dominate the world wouldn't have some of the victims of that imperial impulse willing to do the bidding of bin Laden and others, would it?

I know I'm pissing in the wind here. This country has acted with immoral impunity since day one. No big surprise – it's what most gummints do the world over – but the US has made an art form of the hyprocrisy of it, don't you think?

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